Talk:Danse

Edit War

It is apparent that there is an edit war going on on this article between people who haven't finished the game and don't want spoilers (which is pathetic, since over 95% of the articles in this wiki contain spoilers - I don't see anyone complaining about finding out that Ulysses is the main antagonist of the Lonesome Road DLC, for instance), and people with no social life (like me) who already have finished it and seek to improve the repository of knowledge that is the very purpose of any wiki.

There, I have said my word. --Loub (talk) 21:38, November 12, 2015 (UTC)

I came here to check what perk Danse gives at max loyalty but ended up findning out he's actually a synth. Holy shit that's one major spoiler.

To the above (unsigned) user, please do not visit the Shaun page, or any page for that matter. The purpose of the wiki is to catalog the games, not to provide a spoiler free guide. NobodyPro (talk) 08:42, November 13, 2015 (UTC)

Well here's hoping someone eventually makes a spoiler free guide so we can all stop using this wiki...

"Oh, look, I have to waste my time so I'll just insult this Wiki by saying it does not hide its spoilers, when its goal is to write objective articles, which everyone is free to read." Such a nonsense coming from your side, anon. Not only that, but what makes the articles about Fallout, 2, 3 or New Vegas look like now to you? Hmmmm? ☢ Energy X ☣ 11:51, November 28, 2015 (UTC)

The people contributing to this wiki were the first to throw insults here; "people who haven't finished the game and don't want spoilers (which is pathetic" - Loub. That kind of behavior is why I have a bad impression of this wiki. Just because I didn't want spoilers means I'm "pathetic." Sure... nice job staying civil guys. It's not that I didn't expect spoilers at all. I knew there'd be spoilers somewhere on the page. I just didn't expect them to be right at the very beginning of the page. I was going to open the page then quickly scroll past the spoilers down to the information about his perk, like I had successfully done on many of the other companion pages without getting anything spoiled. It bothered me, for sure. But I was going to let it go. I thought I'd check out the "Talk" page for the heck of it, and in the first post I see I'm being called "Pathetic". That's when I ACTUALLY started getting bothered by this whole thing.

You should know that not all sites need to post "WARNING! Spoilers! Don't read this!", just because you want them to do so. You entered the site at your own risk. It has not been a problem before, and we don't need you to start making up excuses why we need to hide content or post warnings. Because, really, every piece of info on this site can be considered as a spoiler in one way or another. ☢ Energy X ☣ 21:09, November 28, 2015 (UTC)

OK, so I'm not the only one to be unlucky enough to read the first line of the wiki page and feel misery right after that. And yes, I just wanted to read about his perk. That's a bit cruel, isn't it? I think, there is a way to prevent this by mentioning his "serial number" at the end of the paragraph and not bold. I know that this is not how the wiki should be edited. But I think, for this article it would be the right thing to do. ComediNyan (talk) 05:19, November 29, 2015 (UTC)

Romance and Faction

I'm a bit confused by the mention that Danse will no longer be a companion if you become an enemy of the Brotherhood so if I try and pursue the romance with him am I forced to complete the game as allied with the Brotherhood? Or can I after Blind Betrayal concentrate on the Railroad arc and complete their ending without losing the affinity and romance with Danse?

- You can romance Danse after Blind Betrayal has been completed, as long as you have not betrayed the BOS. You can leave Listening Post Bravo, and then head straight back to him. In order to keep Danse as a companion past that point, though, you need either side with the BOS or not continue the main quest line. --Lindsaybrooker (talk) 18:49, December 22, 2015 (UTC)

- I'm doing quests for the Institute. It seems that he won't follow you anymore even if you have a romance. He just stays where I left him before traveling to the Institute, and I can only trade with him. But it also might be a bug.

- The only way to keep him is to be sided with the Brotherhood, even after Blind Betrayal. If you do quests for any other faction and betray the Brotherhood, he won't talk to you, only open the trade dialogue when you try to speak to him. I haven't tried doing a Minutemen ending (which I assume is the same as an independent ending in NV),however, so that might also be a possibility as he seems to like the Minutemen. Gatortribe (talk) 05:24, November 15, 2015 (UTC)

Minutemen could be an option I guess. It's weird he would be so faction locked after the events of Blind Betrayal I think Minutemen storyline only involves liberating the Commonwealth from the Institute instead of shooting everyone up.It needs play testing I suppose, we'll get all the info before too long. Until With Our Powers Combined which seems to involve blowing them up but I'm not sure if that's pre-ending or epilogue.

Ending spoilers: Siding with the Minutemen makes you have to shoot down the Prydwen, meaning he will only trade with you (post-Blind Betrayal) or be hostile (pre-Blind Betrayal). So he's locked to the Brotherhood only, which kinda sucks. Hopefully there will be mods that remove faction dependency from Danse, Deacon, and X6-88.

That would be ideal or if there's a console command for it. But doesn't With Our Powers Combined (shooting down Prydwen) take place after the ending though? You get the cutscene and the war never changes after blowing up the Institute. And since you need 5 artillery-capable settlements it kind of feels like it's epilogue as opposed to a main story missio.

I have not fully tested all scenarios, however:

• Before completing Blind Betrayal, betraying the Brotherhood will cause him to become hostile toward you. It is not possible to romance him before then, so there's no other scenarios.
• After completing Blind Betrayal and after flirting with him, betraying the Brotherhood will cause him to actively ignore you. He won't respond to you talking to him and he will actively walk away from you and turn to face away from you. He also appears to return to Post Bravo, as he was previously stationed in Sanctuary before I betrayed the brotherhood. I would wager this is the same reaction you will get before flirting with him.
• I have not yet tested if Romancing him before betraying the Brotherhood will surpass his attachment to the Brotherhood. Based on his quotes and obvious devotion to the Brotherhood even after his exile, I'd wager that, unfortunately, Danse is only available for coitus if you're allied with the Brotherhood - end of. Emptylord (talk) 20:33, November 20, 2015 (UTC)

Correct, even when you have romanced him, you still can't betray the Brotherhood. Also, of note, he loses his essential status and can be killed. I didn't try betraying the Brotherhood and adding all the companion factions to him though, which might actually work.

I've also done a lot of digging since I last posted, it appears that there's a script that checks what stage you're on for "Blind Betrayal" and if the stage is the "BoS302Exiled" value then it triggers a script variable "IsBoSHostile" to "True" so you might be able to set the stage to 0, making the game believe Blind Betrayal (BoS302) never happened, and it won't matter as long as you've started the one that comes after it (BoS302B). There were some other global variables that would need changed too, I can't recall off the top of my head but you can find it near the top of the list that displays when you use the "tst" command. This is everything I've found so far but it doesn't seem like it's possible to change this without a Creation Kit, I'm afraid. It might be if you're any good with making mods in TES5Edit, but I am not so I wouldn't know. --Gatortribe (talk) 20:50, November 20, 2015 (UTC)

So that comment in your post has a fix that prevents the Brotherhood from turnign hostile with Danse as a conmpanion but seems stopping Danse from ignoring you after the Prydwen goes boom hasn't been found. Is there a list like that after missions that involve destroying the Prydwn? If there's a value or a script that relates to Danse's feelings towards the player or if there are commands that can affect your affiliation with certain factions perhaps the answer would lie in setting the Brotherhood as allies again even if you blow them up. I don't know how faction reputation is dictated in this game. I don't know all this technical stuff is just jargon to me.

No, I don't have a fix for either of those(but if I did inadvertently give one, do share!). The script seems to override your console commands and I'm not really sure how to set two factions as being friends. It's possible, if someone knows how to use TES5Edit, to make a mod that would set BrotherhoodOfSteel and BoSDanseEnemyFaction to be allies with each other but at the moment they are flagged as enemies. Setreputation only seems to work with NPCs and not factions, so that's not an option. EDIT: Just saw someone posted a mod for it, hooray! --Gatortribe (talk) 19:58, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

Guess we'll just have to wait for more modding and more powerful modding tools. It doesn't make much sense to me considering the Brotherhood want to kill him after discovering he's a synth. You'd think he might not hate the Sole Survivor for wanting to help his kind (especially if they romanced him too)

Cabot

Danse liked threat option while speaking to brother Thomas during the "Emogene Takes a Lover" quest, and replied "one way or another" to it. Just if it isn't considered as "reasonable" talk option, thought I'd note about it. --85.76.175.255 12:16, November 17, 2015 (UTC)

Armor Bug

.

I think I found something that helps with this bug.

I do show inventory of my danse, the normal BOS armor i gave him but also a duplicate LOCKED one too. I guess that's what's reducing his carry weight

So what I did was remove the BOS armor just normally in game.

I displayed his inventory once again with the console. He's still has BOS armor even though i just took it out and it looks like he's wearing the frame only.

So I manually removed each piece of bugged armor from his inventory and lastly the atomcat frame. He looks really weird now without a weapon He only has the BOS uniform now.

Lastly, I return to the game and command him to go inside a standing piece of frame and armor with a fusion core.

End result? He can carry a lot more stuff now. The game recovered his hood and uniform. The BOS armor is still in his in game inventory and can be selected tho

I'm not that far into the game, so i haven't gotten to the beytral quest yet or w/e gets him the atomcat armor.

Edit:

Okay... so i think this turns him into a regular human companion... When i sent him to one of my settlements, he strips the power armor, and since i took his BOS uniform and hood, he was naked in his underwear.

I really hope this doesn't screw up the character for me.

Edit 2:

Haha I think I got it working. After all that, I enabled and disabled him. He respawns wtih the power armor, however its no selectable in his inventory BOS Hood and Atomcat frame is locked.

Page Split

The page should be split between Paladin Danse, and the Synth that replaces him - his (or rather, the synth's) ingame affinity dialogue - if you save it - confirms that he was with the brotherhood before he was replaced with a synth, so M7-97 should get a separate page. 74.69.217.236 18:28, November 24, 2015 (UTC)

This could be a good idea - in any case, I'm not sure "Synth" should be listed as his race. Even the official guide lists him as human to avoid spoilers. The info is on his profile anyway, no need for it to be right there. LordSchmee (talk) 21:03, November 24, 2015 (UTC)

Could we please keep this spoiler-free? I only just have had Danse as a chooseable companion, tried to look up some info only to be hit in the face with quite a major spoiler.

So, whoever's busy returning the spoiler on the page under the guise "I don't give a damn whether it is spoiler-free or not", i hope you realize that kind of behaviour is pathetic.

Please add the information under a spoiler-tag, it'd be much appreciated.

-The purpose of a wiki is to provide the most accurate information for anyone, it is not your personal handbook and it will have spoiler information. If you really don't want to be spoiled, you should take it upon yourself to not visit any wiki.

The page will not be split. Paladin117^{>>iff bored;} 06:27, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

Huh. I was under the impression that wikia itself was shit, but the users and admins were actually someone competent. clearly I was mistaken if they won't even entertain a simple page split. 74.69.217.236 06:31, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

What would go on the page that would differentiate the two at all? Paladin117^{>>iff bored;} 06:36, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

Naturally the technical stuff would stay the same, since they're the same NPC in the game files - But everything regarding events before Blind Betrayal would go on the Danse page, and everything after it would go on the M7-97 page. Since they're both companions, (one temporary, one perm) their likes and dislikes would stay - but with the differences (synth comments, attacking brotherhood etc). I'm also not aware of a precedent for having two pages for one in-game character, but we do have a precedent for the reverse of multiple characters baseIDs/refIDs sharing the same page. 74.69.217.236 06:39, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

They're both permanent companions, the only difference is a slight change in dialogue. It's not like he suddenly becomes a different person. Paladin117^{>>iff bored;} 06:53, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

Danse effectively functions as a temporary companion, as his perk can't be obtained until after the completion of an unrelated faction story quest - which locks his affinity from updating until after the completion of that quest. and Yes, in-game they're the same character baseID/refID, but in the story line he *does* suddenly become a different person, since he got replaced by a synth. 74.69.217.236 06:58, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

I was actually under the impression that Danse had -always- been a synth, even from his recruitment into the brotherhood and long before we meet him. His mind was wiped, he believed he was human, and joined up. It's certain either way that from the moment we meet him in Fallout 4 he is already a synth, and at no point in the active timeline is he "replaced" by M7-97.

According to dialogue with the synth, Danse joined the brotherhood as a child down in DC. There's no evidence of the Institute implanting synths that way, whereas there's plenty of evidence of them replacing people with synths. Also, Father has only recently started making child synths, not the ~20-30 years ago danse joined up. It may have happened before we ever met him, but the only real point that we know for certain it has happened by is Institutionalized, since that's when we get the data that reveals M7-97 and Danse have the same DNA. 74.69.217.236 13:10, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

The only reason people know about third generation synths is because the Institute tried to infiltrate a synth into Diamond City without replacing somebody. So, there's plenty of evidence. On the other hand, there is no evidence of when Danse was made a synth. It could've been during the game, it could've been a decade ago. We don't know. Paladin117^{>>iff bored;} 15:56, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

On the other hand, Harkness, another Gen 3 synth, was in the Capital Wasteland where he got his memory flashed. The same could be said for Danse; maybe he had his memories of childhood flashed and then was programmed to believe that he was a trader who wanted to join the BoS. Ultimately, I think it's supposed to be a players interpretation thing with no real answer (until DLC, at least). --Gatortribe (talk) 05:34, November 29, 2015 (UTC)

There is no evidence whatsoever of Danse ever having been human. His memories of his supposedly human past, including his childhood, are presumably false. It's strange (and an oversight from the writers) that Danse never questions or addresses this, and his own position is not known. Even supposing that all of his memories were false, there is the further question of who gave him those memories and why? The Railroad does not seem to recognise him. It's possible (but quite a bit of stretch) that the Institute created him to be a BOS plant and wiped his memories so that he could be more convincing at his role, to be "recalled" at a later date. Anyway it's a loose end and it would seem that Bethesda's writers didn't put too much thought into it--certainly not as much as us players.--Natnair (talk) 08:36, February 27, 2016 (UTC)

Probably too late to join in on the conversation, but Danse's race should remain as 'Human' in the infobox and his true race hidden behind a spoiler tag on the actual page. --StagsKilledDragons (talk) 18:27, December 18, 2015 (UTC)

I think Danse was replaced sometime after he arrived in the commonwealth, cause if you think about it if he was planted so long ago and the Institute's reach extended to D.C their would have been more sleeper agents in the brotherhoods rank than just Danse. Also the medical reports of his headaches don't state of a past history of them. Nick3258 (talk) 17:39, December 22, 2015 (UTC)

Race

His race in the game data is "Human" (as is the case for Mayor McDonough, in contrast Nick Valentine has a race of "Gen 2 Synth"). The race will have some effect on stats and such. So we have a difference between his technical race and his story/in-world race here I guess. --Alfwyn (talk) 01:04, November 25, 2015 (UTC)

Is GECK software out already? What does it say about other Synths? And our infoboxes have always used game data for the fields. Great Mara (talk) 19:40, November 28, 2015 (UTC)

You can view the technical "under the hood" attributes with the latest TES5Edit build that has Fallout 4 support. Danse is indeed listed as human, but I think every gen 3 synth is too since they're pretty much human in every way possible. The only difference is they get a different "death package" which includes the synth component (you can't see that with the show inventory command, hence why it's in the death package). --Gatortribe (talk) 19:47, November 28, 2015 (UTC)

I did my own dump, there are some ways to poke in the data; it's similar to Skyrim which was similar to FO3. One difference should be the ability to use power armour, which seems to require the human race. --Alfwyn (talk) 21:09, December 5, 2015 (UTC)

Massive plot spoilers should have a warning. I ended up on this page strictly because it was the first result returned by Google. This page has a duty to warn such visitors that it's a site filled with spoilers.

The "Edit War" post below says that ridiculous because the whole site is filled with spoilers; that's some backwards logic right there. That's even MORE reason to have a warning, not less!

You have a duty to actually use your brain cells and realise that a wiki for a game will have information about the game. Great Mara (talk) 03:44, December 27, 2015 (UTC)

To be fair, most wikia have a label at the top of the page that inform users of spoilers. We should get one too. --188.25.141.131 12:11, January 3, 2016 (UTC)

Lmao so people who don't want to be spoiled are dumb? The DA/ME Wiki does it successfully without any effort. But that isn't how this wiki works which is fine, but don't say that not wanting spoilers in a wiki is stupid. --StagsKilledDragons (talk) 04:57, January 10, 2016 (UTC)

Clarke Approval

I'm having trouble reproducing this:

"-Saying they will kill (not eradicate) all the ghouls after confronting Clarke."

There's no indication that Danse heard it, let alone loved it, and there's no change in ca_affinity. Does it work? Are there additional steps which need to be taken? If so, we should include a note explaining it a bit better.

--A bit more testing & I successfully reproduced it. I think I know how to change the article..

"Danse liked that" but reacted negatively

During the first conversation with Jack Cabot choosing the option interesting results in Danse saying "This is all just smoke and mirrors and fictional nonsense. I thought you had a head on those shoulders" but it says that he liked that. I'm not sure what exactly sure those two match up.

Bugs Section

Verified the bug where Danse appears in the inaccessible warehouse. I had just completed Show No Mercy and had advanced The Molecular Level with Elder Maxson to speak with Proctor Ingram in the Boston Airport. I noticed at that point Danse was not with me. I took a vertibird down to the Boston Airport and he still didn't show up. I used the player.moveto command to move to him and he was exactly as described in the bug. The remedy of reloading and using the console command to move him to me worked and the game continued normally.--DocSilence (talk) 18:41, February 16, 2016 (UTC)